Above: Fay School’s new primary school off Middle Road
A message from Fay School:
Fay School has announced that it will increase its financial aid budget by 33% for the 2011-2012 school year, with a special focus on providing tuition assistance to Southborough residents.
“Our expanded commitment to financial aid is part of the school’s ongoing efforts to make a Fay education available to a larger pool of qualified students, regardless of need,” explained Beth Whitney, Director of Admission.
Fay’s new “Southborough Scholars” program makes financial aid available to students from Pre-Kindergarten through ninth grade. “We are now able to commit to meeting the full demonstrated financial need of every Southborough resident who is admitted to the school,” Whitney said.
Fay’s Board of Trustees has supplemented the school’s financial aid budget in each of the past two years, allocating temporary increases in response to the economic downturn. At its winter meeting in January, the Board approved a permanent increase of 33%. In particular, the trustees’ decision significantly expands the amount of tuition assistance available to students in Fay’s new Primary School, which includes Pre-Kindergarten through grade two.
“Fay’s increased commitment to tuition assistance demonstrates our belief that financial need should not be a barrier for qualified Southborough students,” Whitney said.
Financial aid is not a replacement for PILOT. It’s just a weak gesture that will only apply to those individuals who qualify. In light of all the new buildings that have been constructed in the past couple of years at Fay, I think financial aid to a few pales in comparison to the actual tax value of these properties, value that is not taxable.
John,
there was not a reply button on your newest post so i am replying to this one. The reason i decided to try and make a distinction in my last post is that there seemed to be some divergence in what we were originally discussing.
what i am trying to figure out is how Fay was granted building permit (s), and if you have every tried to get one in this town you know how arduous that process is, for 2 buildings without having to show promise or work out something for the municipalities–i understand the tax break they get but it is indeed a burden on the town. A huge one. And the children who enter our school system, well, i think that an argument can be made that they now offer a K program and we should be reimbursed if they are not going to offer slots to their teacher’s children at whatever rates they work out with their staff. In fact I am not sure why the town is not reimbursed for the kids who enter our system period, that seems antiquated.
The financial aid that is given to the students to the the town is of a separate nature–as you stated it does not affect the pocketbooks of the town as an entity. And the discussion we have been having about it branches off from the topic of your original post and that is that the financial aid given out is of inconsequential comparable amounts when put up against what the town shoulders.
what i do feel is on the horizon is that Fay must realize that due to the economic times–and surely someone must trawl this site–that at some point we as a town are going to get together and turn on them and it will not be because we want our children to go there but rather because we have tired of having fundraisers for overcrowded classrooms while they are not paying their fair share.
Yup….I got a demolition and building permit back in 2003. Cosidering the reputation of the town regarding building permits, I fared well. As far as Fay….and I am not sure of this, but I believe that they have more levity when it comes to educational property. In light of how these institutions are allowed to build, I wonder if they are allowed comprehensive permits due to the non-profit status or, and remember I really don’t know, if they come under the Dover Amenment that is so often referred to when SMOC or other non-profits try to establish group homes, etc.
I should have included this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dover_Amendment
so when it came up for zoning, to be built and the “Dover Amendment” was referenced was there counsel present representing the town showing that X amount of bodies in a structure would need another police/fire body to cover and that would need to be paid for by the school?
and if so, what exactly was the loophole? because now that the town is in fiscal dire straits i think it is time to go back to the school and say “we have 2 police officers during 9-3pm and if we have to choose between our townspeople and your school you get chosen last–ante up” because besides the unheated cages (son is dreading) i am really trying to see what they are doing for us as a town right now as a whole financially and i do not say this with any sort of vinegar–
If you are in the construction business it makes it a bit easier, we have done a few renovations–stands to reason when your house is from 1812. The fire chief actually came over with the Falconi crew to check out our boiler a few years back, i think he called it “a classic caddie” before we took it out but i digress….
something tells me that Al can really shed some light on this topic, there seems to be either a piece missing or we have been duped for a really long time.
the line that i use “change is noisy” comes from the feedback that the company Sun Chips got when they changed to bags made from recycled material, the bags are indeed incredibly noisy; however, it is all recycled making one think about moving forward and treading lightly on the earth. So, i say it again: “change is noisy” if we want to change something about the process between our town and Fay then we are going to have to figure out the facts and be really noisy–like protest noisy, not blogging chit chat–that is quiet.
There are a lot of permits and licenses that are due “by right” which means that if you meet the letter of the law the town had to issue you the permit or license. Examples include dog licenses and subdivisions. I learned this when a developer was building in our neighborhood. The neighborhood hired a lawyer to advise us and she said that we needed to negotiate rather than try to kill the development. Her advice was that the developer as a property owner had rights too and in the end if the crossed the t’s and dotted the I’s he was going to be able to build.
We have more wiggle room when it comes to zoning and building variances. Those items are far more discretionary.
Wow…I’m underwhelmed…
Most people in town pay more for one house than Fay School does for the whole village of houses they’ve just built…
Fay School and St Marks should pay fee for service. They should be charged for fire, police and DPW services. I hope the Payment In Lieu Of Taxes (PILOT) committee considers charging the schools.
Somebody please enlighten me,… why the heck would a family that cannot afford the full tuition to Fay School – send their kid to this school,…. when you can get the “same” education for free? I think for a school like Fay – if you have to ask how much tuition is,… you can’t afford it.
Private schools have something like a private university’s pricing structure. They want social class diversity – at least a little – so they give financial aid to allow some children other than the very rich to attend. This is a good thing, but it’s also pretty weird.
At the college level, Harvard now provides enough aid to make it free for students whose parents make $80,000 or less. The nominal cost of Harvard is about $50,000 a year (still less than a cell at Walpole, er, Cedar Junction). Fay and St. Mark’s don’t have the multi-billion dollar endowments that makes that possible.
Sorry, I have to laugh,… “social class diversity” (in pre-k – grade 2???) If I wanted my kid to experience social class diversity, I would not be sending him/her to Fay school. I still stand by my original post – if you have to ask how much it costs to send you kid to Fay school for Pre-K – You Can’t afford it.
If they really wanted to help out society (our town) – why don’t they give our town more than $10K per year?
There’s financial aid, so some people who can’t afford can still ask. That’s the reality. Yes, it comes is relatively small doses.
My own public school education was far more economically diverse than the one Fay offers, no doubt. I went to school with kids who were hungry and with kids who drove shiny new cars.
Yes, Fay should give more. But making some activities tax-free was and is a good way to build a better society.
I know I feel so much better paying for fire and police protection for Fay and St. Marks. Gosh, it just makes me feel runny inside.
Runny? Hokaaay!
We’ll put you down as feeling they should burn to the ground. Does that mean you live in the Uncommonwealth of Massachusetts?
Seriously, do you think we would be better off as a whole if non-profits were treated the same way as profit-making enterprises?
could not agree more. and as far as financial aid at a Private School it is there for the students who meet the schools standards and qualify but also for the students the Private School wants to acquire for their student body and actively seek out, yes they try and build their student body and it is their right it is “private schooling”.
When you look at the social stratification of the Private Schools there is actually diversity among them: compare St. Sebastian’s to Andover Academy and then St. Marks with Worcester Academy. Public schools have there own obvious diversity or in some cases lack of it depending on where you live. If I had my true choice I would live more towards the city but I am not alone in my decision making ;)
Of course Fay should give the Town more–they should be paying for the services they use but there seems to be 2 separate “discussions” here–private and public education and accountability for Fay to pay for what they are using.
Folks….Carrie…..if you look at my original post (which was the first on this thread) I poked at the fact that Fay is offering more financial aid to Southborough kiddos. I’m not comparing public to private. Fay is a well funded private institution. Yeah, the private schools add a certain prestige to the town for some folks. I’m on the fence on that view. The concern here is, if you take a very close look at ALL of the construction in the past 2- 3 years at Fay, and the private residences that were bought by Fay and taken off the tax rolls, I think that the increase in financial aid is …..well….nothing compared to the increased burden on the town. Being a former firefighter, I am well aware of the number of alarms the fire department receives from the many buildings within the complex. They use medical and police services, and like St. Mark’s staff, some of their children attend our public schools. Fair is fair…..the financial aid is only available to those who qualify and is not a benefit to the town as a whole. They have the means, and should be more willing to pay for municipal services.
Kelly
Having put 3 kids through college I am a bit more cynical about “financial aid”. What we really have is a sophisticated discount structure that permits heavy price discrimination. The result is revenue maximization for the institution. Social diversity is a distant second in the goal structure.
Al, your phrase “sophisticated discount structure” is apt. Can I steal it?
The alternatives to this structure:
– Price what the market will bear and let the already wealthy dominate the next generation’s intellectual capital.
– Pay for higher education through taxes, as most European democracies do.
Which of the three is best? Feel free to suggest other options. Is there a way to sustain meritocracy and egalitarianism without our current form of progressive taxation through discounts or tax-funded education based solely on ability (which by the way also favors the already blessed).
Or do you suggest we give up on meritocracy, egalitarianism, and social mobility?
Actually, I have been having this debate on another site. I believe that for at least the high end Colleges and Universities the real play is a lifetime revenue model.
In order to be considered elite, you have to attract high end talent. If there was a normal non discriminatory pricing, the actual price of a college education would be lower and the total revenue to the institution would be lower. Instead, what we have is a scheme were the universities say to qualified parents, how much money do you have? Give it to me.
If you went to buy a house or a car you would not accept this model but it is ok for Colleges and Universities.
I am not really that much of a knuckle dragger but I think we should call the scheme what it really is and not pretend that its first goal is social welfare. The primary function is revenue maximization for the institution.
So Al, you don’t have an alternative pricing model to offer, right? Which do you choose? What are its consequences?
Simply giving a derogatory characterization of the current pricing model in the U.S. doesn’t help, even if it has a grain of truth. What do you think we should do about it? Sell it like cars? Then, without government intervention in the form of more direct aid – and you know the Republicans would oppose that – goodbye to broadly available opportunities for the middle class and occasionally the poor to attend elite colleges. Maybe that would be o.k., except that state legislatures all over are ripping the guts out of higher ed budgets.
America was founded on a strong ethic of social mobility. The current system, whatever its flaws, sustains that. Do you have a better idea?
Dj: When you refer to students getting the “same” education for free, I’m assuming you mean that you don’t perceive any difference between the offerings of public schools and private schools. You might want to check, if you haven’t already done so, Fay’s “Facts” about the education and activities offered in the school. Just a couple of facts: average class size is 12, World Languages including French and Spanish in Pre-K through grade five; Chinese, French, Latin, and Spanish in grades six through nine. If I remember correctly, the average class size at Finn is approx. 20, and languages are offered at the middle school – Spanish or French (for 2 1/2 years), and a Latin elective that some students can take for part of the year. These may be some of the factors influencing families when they’re choosing a school for their children.
djd66-
because perhaps at first they could but something happened in their family makeup and now they cannot. My brother was on a partial academic scholarship to Rivers because, well, because my dad did not make enough and he needed the guided structure and was and is so bright. My brother graduated with a 4.0 and went on to receive almost full financial aide from a top notch university and then graduate top 5 in his class at Tufts Dental. He would never be where he is today without that starting help at Rivers which my parents were so grateful for.
i say this without one bit of sarcasm at all–my brother pays it forward everyday
djd66-
there is actually a difference in what private schools cost, they do not all charge the same and that is part of what makes some so difficult to get into (BB&N for example) Worcester Academy for example charges considerably less then Rivers as in ten of thousands of grands less.
If a student has a lot to offer a school–whether that area is in academics, athletics or has already shown great potential to be a leader then he or she is seen as an asset to the student body and is sought out by the private institution and tuition is adjusted.
Fay is not in the real business of helping out our town, they are in the business of providing private education for a cost and making a profit by which they do a multitude of things with –one of them is provide funds to kids who cannot afford the full tuition–many of the Pre-k and K students are sibling. We as a town can request/mandate or devise ways for them to give the town funds but they are a private institution with paying customers.
Isn’t this quote the point of the PILOT program to begin with: “they are in the business of providing private education for a cost and making a profit…” The fact that they may offer some scholarships does not negate the fact that they are probably charging more for one student than what they “donate” to the town.
They own their own village over there now, maybe they should succeed from the town and provide their own services… or pay for what they use, and pay for the children who live at Fay or St Marks with their parents, and then go to our schools. They shouldn’t have it both ways, we’re all struggling in town to pay our taxes, yet they don’t have to pay because they’re supposedly a “non-profit”? You can be darn sure they’re making a nice profit – they just built millions of dollars worth of buildings, taking land out of the tax base in the process. Sorry if I sound nasty (I’m really just trying to make a point), but the townspeople are subsidizing their services and its just WRONG. And don’t say that they add “prestige” to the town, that doesn’t pay our bills.
What is interesting, if you look at the ST. Marks annual report here: http://www.stmarksschool.org/2009-10-Report/index.html on page 23 you will see they had “net operating income” of $173,000.00 – net operating income – isn’t that the same thing as profit?
Yesterday I made a posting that I had intended to go on this thread. Instead, I put it on “Rooney asks St Marks and Fay to Contribute More”. The issues on each are certainly related, but some of my points reference ones made here more directly. I will not repost. It just becomes a little more fun to find, if you care to.
Alas, the annual report is still here!!!
Here’s a link to Karen’s comment in the other post: https://mysouthborough.com/2011/02/03/rooney-asks-st-marks-and-fay-to-contribute-more/comment-page-1/#comment-73989